building a 10,000+ rpm screamer!

IDriftNaked · Post by **IDriftNaked** » Mon Dec 04, 2006 11:56 pm

Wassup my 4g6x brothers! Well my g54b blew last week due to a crapped oil pump and my girl who cant drive stick for crap! (long story!). anywho this is my plan.... I'm going to use a wide block 4g64 block, an eclipse dohc head and a 1.6 crank. now i just need to know where can i find turbo pistons and rods for it? i was thinking of using a t70 turbo, but what would be the proper turbo? o yea and manifolds (intake and exhaust). i'm fresh out of the box with the destroker idea and I need your guys' help on this as much as i can!
Thanks fellas

IDriftNaked · Post by **IDriftNaked** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 12:21 am

2.1 crank eh? is that pretty much the 2.0 crank?? if not were can i pick up 1 of those bad boys?

jeffball610 · Post by **jeffball610** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 12:24 pm

A 2.1 will get you to 10k. But if you want to live a little lower in the RPM, you could easily build a 2.0L to run 9k. Again, the place to concentrate is the head. A motor that runs that high, might not be that streetable though. It'll run, but you'll have a really lumpy idle. A short runner intake is also key in this setup.

IDriftNaked · Post by **IDriftNaked** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 11:08 pm

What kind of head work do you guys recomend?

jeffball610 · Post by **jeffball610** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 11:51 pm

Slight port work (1G head), stiff valves (at least 90lb seat pressure), stainless steel valves (probably nitrided), titanium retainers, bump sticks of your choice (HKS etc.). Check with builders like Slowboy Racing, Buschur Racing, Magnus Motorsports, Jackson Auto Machine, and FFWD Connection. You'll want to do a 3 angle valve job and cut the valve guides in the port area. 10k is no joke, do your homework! Plan to spend around $10k if you're having someone build your motor. You can probably get away with $5k if you do most of the work yourself.

Just an example:
http://www.slowboyracing.com/more.php?id=4824&
http://www.magnusmotorsports.com/engines/dsm.htm (look at the bottom under crate motors)

Post by **DJpowerHaus** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 4:33 pm

If I were to do it I would use stock size valves as they are lighter than oversized valves. The lighter the better. Dual springs (stiffer, less harmonics), titanium retainers (lighter), Evo roller rockers (lighter)($21 each from Slowboy), solid lifters... and I'm not even sure what cams you'd use for something like this.

I'm also not sure what rpms piggyback ECU's and stock coils can support. This is one engine that would benefit from a coil on plug setup and a nice strong 4 channel CDI ignition.

You'll also want a clutch and flywheel that can take those revs. If I were doing this engine (and I might one day!) I would use the 6 bolt wideblock 5.5" twinplate clutch from www.10000rpm.com. Its a hell of a clutch for $895.

Also you would need ARP hardware througout (rod bolts come with rods) and some good machining and balancing. Also, a nice harmonic balancer ($280.95 Fluidampr from Summit, $309 from Slowboy, $469 ATI from Slowboy) would be good to have with an engine spinning this fast.

Luckily it has been done before. Shops like Magnus and Slowboy, I know, both offer kits for the custom rods and pistons ($1063 Manley/Wiseco from Slowboy) that you need. Both shops have running 2.1L engines too and that experience could be helpful.

If you're doing this for a RWD setup, you should consider an RX7 transmission. It can take the 10,000rpms that this engine will spin to unlike the Starion or W5x transmissions.

rarson · Post by **rarson** » Thu Dec 07, 2006 2:16 am

Like DJ said, I'm pretty sure solid lifters would be a must above around 9k. That would be my biggest concern. I also think the stock-sized valves would probably work better, as with high rpms, velocity is the name of the game.

As far as cams go, I'm not sure whether the solid lifters would require a completely different cam profile. However, if you are revving to 10k, you're going to want a very healthy cam that will help the engine actually make power that high.

Post by **DJpowerHaus** » Thu Dec 07, 2006 10:56 pm

Wouldnt it be cheaper to get some NASCAR used Ti valves and adapt the head to fit them?

Robert Venable · Post by **Robert Venable** » Fri Dec 08, 2006 12:46 am

DJpowerHaus wrote:Wouldnt it be cheaper to get some NASCAR used Ti valves and adapt the head to fit them?

You ARE joking right??

rarson · Post by **rarson** » Fri Dec 08, 2006 1:14 am

Wow. I knew ebay had some good deals on Nascar parts (rods especially) but I had no idea there were titanium valves available too.

Post by **DJpowerHaus** » Fri Dec 08, 2006 3:22 pm

Hell yeah.. $30 for 8 titanium valves... pay someone $1000 to make them work. You're still ahead.

Robert Venable · Post by **Robert Venable** » Fri Dec 08, 2006 8:53 pm

I was thinking the same thing about the sizeing issue, but he does have a point. $1370.00 is a lot of machining and shipping.

IDriftNaked · Post by **IDriftNaked** » Tue Dec 19, 2006 5:12 pm

wow i was plannin on dumpin about 8k into this engine build but now im kinda having a new idea for a fairlady twin turbo engine what do u guys think

peregrine · Post by **peregrine** » Tue Dec 19, 2006 5:32 pm

IDriftNaked wrote:wow i was plannin on dumpin about 8k into this engine build but now im kinda having a new idea for a fairlady twin turbo engine what do u guys think

you just lost all credibility on this site. try actually getting a car running then have the huge dreams of expensive motors. its great to want to be different but if you dont have reasonable goals theyll never come to fruition. take this as you see fit. you can call me a dick or whatever but id like to see you actually get your car running with a stock motor and get all the bugs worked out than try and dish out $15000 for a car that sits in your garage never running.

Post by **DJpowerHaus** » Tue Dec 19, 2006 8:47 pm

peregrine wrote:Id like to see you actually get your car running with a stock motor and get all the bugs worked out than try and dish out $15000 for a car that sits in your garage never running.

What are you trying to say?

Robert Venable · Post by **Robert Venable** » Tue Dec 19, 2006 9:06 pm

I think he is trying to say thats it's better to have/build/tune a cheap low HP car that actually runs than a very expensive could/should be powerful car that never gets finished because you have no clue what you are doing.

peregrine · Post by **peregrine** » Tue Dec 19, 2006 10:00 pm

DJpowerHaus wrote:
peregrine wrote:Id like to see you actually get your car running with a stock motor and get all the bugs worked out than try and dish out $15000 for a car that sits in your garage never running.
What are you trying to say?

haah i wasnt pointing any fingers dude. my car sat in the garage for the longest time doing nothing so i was coming from that place. you never entered my mind

Robert Venable wrote:I think he is trying to say thats it's better to have/build/tune a cheap low HP car that actually runs than a very expensive could/should be powerful car that never gets finished because you have no clue what you are doing.

thats exactly what im trying to say.

carguyf545 · Post by **carguyf545** » Sun Dec 24, 2006 12:09 pm

He is right, i bought my starion 2 years ago. i wanted to get it running n/a or low boost. pretty much all i have done is pull out the old motor. that goes the same for my talon 2.4 race car. the motor is on the stand ready to go in. the car is caged and waiting on the motor. its all easy stuff. but for some reason i cant get it done. im not a keyboard mechanic, i know the goals i should be able to reach, i just cant reach them. all in all i really suck and need to be shot in the head cause i cant get something easy done.