Project Zero G Forums

My 4G swap is a 2004 Chrysler Crossfire. It's a Limited model, not the SRT6 version. The transmission died about 8,000 miles after I installed an Eaton M90 supercharger and with the lack of affordable aftermarket parts it doesn't make much sense to keep the Mercedes drivetrain. I'm already quite a way into the swap. I have removed the engine, trans,and most of the supporting electronics and wiring harness. The basic plan is to put a stock 6 bolt 4G63 and built TH350 in with Bill's adapter. The 4G and TH350 weigh as much as the stock V6 so i will come out about 130#'s lighter. The Th350 is also very similar in size to the stock Nag1 transmission allowing the use of the stock driveshaft. The 3.2L was a 90* design so there is plenty of room width wise and the engine will sit far enough away from the firewall to run a stock intake manifold with the TB at the rear. I'll post some pics later this evening.

a) we absolutely NEED to see pics of this.

b) are you sure you're ready to do without overdrive?

This is where I'm at so far.

Gentleman Rogue wrote:
b) are you sure you're ready to do without overdrive?

I don't think that will be a problem. I have 3.27:1 axle ratio and 28 inch tall tires on the back. I calculated 2591Rpm @ 60MPH in third gear including a ten percent loss in the non locking torque converter. I calculated 68.22 MPH in first gear @7500RPM. Top speed if it has enough power would be 172MPH. Looks like I may need to go with a smaller tire

Trans tunnell

Look into the 200r4.. It's the same dims as the 350, just the rear mounting pad is about 4-5" rearward (for the extra clutches)
You can get the 'retro kit' from Jegs and I assume others that runs a vacuum lockup.
I did this to a 72 Monte Carlo with 331's in it with posi and 27" tires and was running 2300rpms at 75mph.
Plus you get a 2.8 1st gear!

Does the Prowler share any "performance" parts?? Like rear gears or such?

Errol

Low Rpms on the highway are great for high torque producing V8s. I am thinking 26-2800 rpm would be good for the 4g. Even the stock v6 ran 2600 rpm at 65 and got 30mpg. The 2.8 first gear in the 200r4 sound great as well as the mounting pad being further towards the tail.
The Crossfire is a Mercedes with Chrysler badges stuck on it. The SLK320 shares a lot of parts with it.

77amc wrote:Look into the 200r4.. It's the same dims as the 350, just the rear mounting pad is about 4-5" rearward (for the extra clutches)
You can get the 'retro kit' from Jegs and I assume others that runs a vacuum lockup.
I did this to a 72 Monte Carlo with 331's in it with posi and 27" tires and was running 2300rpms at 75mph.
Plus you get a 2.8 1st gear!

Does the Prowler share any "performance" parts?? Like rear gears or such?

Errol

The yoke from the MB trans unbolts and I'm hoping i can have it welded to the TH350 yoke so I can use the original driveshaft. So far all the measurements I have taken indicate this is possible but I won't know for sure until I get a transmission and actually test fit it. Does anyone know how much space there is between the rear edge of the 4g block and where the oil pan drops down for the sump? I'm looking to see how much space I will have to work with for the front cross-member.
FYI it has independent rear suspension so there is no movement of the driveshaft other than spinning and a small amount of flex that is in the motor mounts and trans mount.

I'm interested in seeing how this turns out. My family owns 3 crossfires.

Disassembling this car has been a breeze. Most of the hardware is e sockets or torx.

This is a really cool swap and i look forward to seeing how it goes. The crossfire is like a newer version of the conquest anyway so its a fine match, hell u could even rebadge it a "crossquest" haha. The NAG1 is a strong tranny its also used in the dodge sprinters, u must have made some serious power to blow it, then again i dont know if the NAG in the crossfire is like the NAG in trucks. What are you going to run in terms of engine management? also will the HVAC wipers lights etc be a problem? I used to be a Chrysler tech but the only thing ive done to a crossfire was replace the starter. If u need anyhelp i still have access to alot of the factory manuals an such, i would love to help this thing happen.

I guesstimate that I was making about 330 crank hp. There are two versions of the NAG1. The w5a330 and the w5a580. V6 cars come with the 330 and v8 and supercharged v6's come with the 580. I believe the 330 is rated for only 230ft# while the 580 can handles over 400ft#.

I am using all factory controls as well as installing a security system. I am going to build my own relay module. The factory locks were pneumatically controlled so I am switching them over to electric and controlling them with the aforementioned security system.

As far as the engine management is concerned I will probably just run a factory ecu. I'm still looking over the tuning choices. For now the goal is 350whp. What do you guys suggest?

Interesting build, I am looking foward to seeing how this turns out. For an ems, I would recommend dsmlink.

Picked up a TH350 transmission this morning. Today I'll see how it fits and post some pics of the progress.

That tail-cone looks a little long. Could it be from a truck?
Might be a th375..? They used them in some taxis, police cars and some light truck apps.
From what I was told, they had the extra clutch-pack to handle more torque.
You can do all sorts of things with that trans.
Just make sure you DONT have the 350C (lockup converter) If so, there will be a small square, 4-prong, white or blue plug sticking upward above the valve-body.
You can install deeper gearsets for a harder launch but still end up with the 1:1 f/d 3rd.
And also can play with the TV cable to hit or downshift at mid-spool.

PM me if you have any info on the trannys for the MLB 320.. Got a friend that the trans went into limp mode and won't go over 20. Oh, and it's AWD$$$

Great build

Errol

It's definitely a THM350. The pic just makes the tail look long.

So how would you rate the Crossfires in general?
Kinda weird rear end but otherwise looks interesting..

Any specifics on brakes and suspension? ie: rear posi/lsd, HD axles, can U fit 22's under it? (jk, although it wouldn't be out of the norm here..)
Will you have enough room for a 3" exhaust? (Dr Gas makes oval or flattened pipes for close tolerances or lowered vehicles)

E

CaughtintheCrossfire wrote:and the engine will sit far enough away from the firewall to run a stock intake manifold with the TB at the rear.

ok but why would you want to?

To center the engine over the original mounts, reduce the cost of the swap, and I am using a water to air intercooler so really short pipping. Moving the engine back three of four inches isn't worth the effort or cost.

The Evo 8,9 Manifolds fit pretty nicely facing the front lol

Well, I am finally working on this project again. Right now I am assembling the wiring harness. Lots of factory circuits are being repurposed for new hardware like rear view camera, DVD, and maybe a few other necessities. So far the project has not cost me anything but that will change soon. I found two 6 bolt motors from searching car-part.com, I just have to inspect them. Hopefully one will be worth building. I have a preliminary transmission mount designed. Its a simple adapter that uses the original trans mount and puts the yoke back into it's original position. i just have to adjust the length for the engine oil pan clearance.

Any updates or pics?

Hey man, if your interested and still have project going, I have one of bills TH350 adapters for sale for $250 since I'm selling my project. I also have a B/M Zgate shifter I can sell pretty cheap with it. Progress looks good so far though man.

I'll buy the adapter from you. I have a complete shifter set up all ready though. Let me know if you take paypal and what the shipping cost to 35816 is.

I just got a new digital camera today. I have to rebuild the diff in my truck this weekend but hopefully i can get some more done on the car and post some pics and updates.

Picked up a 6 Bolt motor today for $400. I'll try and load some pics tomorrow. It's missing the fuel rail, injectors, and turbo but everything else is there.

This engine is in great shape. the guys at the Jyard said they knew the kid who owned the car that this engine came out of and that he had spent a bunch of money on it.

I have the head cleaned up and almost ready to reassemble. The bores are in great shape, I can still see the crosshatch. There was a rebuild tag hidden under the intake manifold. All the bearings look good.

Any suggestions on where to buy a gasket kit?

I hope there is room for this turbo.

NAW.. I don't think you will have any room! Plus, you might burn the paint off of the hood.
I think you should sell (give it) to ME!

Looks great man..

I picked up a 95 GSR integra (roller) a while back and the kid said he still had the motor.. I asked him ifn he'd throw it "in the deal" and he DID! Saying that "oh, it's just like a B18 motor.. Well, NOW I have a 170hp stock engine that I pretty much got for free. (you can install the internals from the B18 and get close to 200hp without too much work

It sure is nice to find deals like that. I missed another one from a guy that was selling his brothers (moved out of state) 95turbo eclipse with an extra engine and cams, upgraded turbo, yadda yadda but I just had a double hernia and couldn't do much. Had to tell him no.

What 's going on with the wiring side of it?
Will you be able to use the dash with the signals from the Mitsu motor?

E

I ended up removing the body control module which is basically a computer controlled relay board. I ordered a few relays to replace only the circuits I need. I am running my new pwr locks off the old skreem module circuit. Right now I have to remove the trunk latch assembly and see if I can put an actuator in place of the old pneumatic unit and get the electric spoiler on a simple up/down two button circuit. I'll add some pics and a schematic once I get everything working.

I've been following this thread about using an Evo8 ecu in a 1G, I might go this route if they get everything worked out.

http://forums.evolutionm.net/ecuflash/4 ... works.html

I found this gasket set on flea bay. What do you guys think? Is it junk?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Performa ... ccessories

it is my personal experience that these motors just LOVE to run. I've had boost leaks the size of pencil erasers on the throttle body, seen people run them with 1 quart of oil for 1000's of miles unknowingly, plenty of stuff.

So for your question of the gasket kit.

Will it work?

probably.

Would I run it on my car?

F*&K NO.

For gaskets I go OEM, and OEM only. Pay more now, save money on "yeah it needs a quart of oil added every time I fill up with gas" later. Do it once do it right.

I have a couple of aftermarket door actuators laying around for that latch if ya want??
E

ps, what about these? I got a set just because.. (I HATE WIRING)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 1171wt_180

Thanks for the offer but I bought a complete keyless entry kit that came with the actuators. I bought a four door kit so I would have an actuator for the hatch and the fuel refill door.
Nice find on the relays.

I ended up buying an oem head gasket and a felpro kit for the rest of the engine. I have tomorrow off and will hopefully get the bottom end assembled.

I cut the balance shaft to make my own stub shaft. I know the end hole (through axis)has to be plugged. I am planning on tapping it and putting a short bolt with Loctite to seal it. What I don't know is if the hole going through the diameter has to be sealed as well. It doesn't look like the oem stub shaft has this hole on VFAQ. My guess is that it doesn't matter.

That hole on the side does not matter and can be left open.

Richard wrote:That hole on the side does not matter and can be left open.

Thanks for confirming.

Good meeting you today. Lets see some more updates

I'm going to try and get this rolling the first three weeks in December. Thanks for the hook up on the parts.

I have the head back together. I blended the valve seats into the ports on the intake side. I'll probably port match the intake and call it done. The exhaust valves were pitted badly so I got a set of SS valves machined and installed.

Looking good man, keep it up

I have the short block assembled and the head ready to install. Looks like I'll have 7.5 inches between the head and firewall. I installed the oil pan right after I took this pic. I may end up putting a big 16g or other bolt on turbo on instead of the Holset to avoid the headaches associated with running the VGT. If anyone wants to make a trade let me know.

SO COOL! Building "In HOUSE" literally!
Keep it going.

I'm gonna have to make mine a rear sump by pulling the pickup and moving it back to #4 main-cap. The biggest problem will be fabbing up the pan.

E

Yeah, IN House, my wife loves it. I had plenty of room in my storage unit to build it there but it's a lot warmer in the kitchen.

I ordered a SFI flexplate, it's the last piece I need to mate the engine and trans. I'm building motor mounts today.

Engine fits great. There is some minor trans tunnell clearance issues I have to work on this weekend. I got the wrong torque converter so I ordered a new one from Jegs today. There is tons of room for the head, intake, etc...
The engine is tilted a little to the rear because it is balancing on just the two motor mounts.
I have plenty of work to do.

FYI I pulled the V6 short block out by hand and I put this in by hand. The 4G is much lighter even with the cast iron block.

CaughtintheCrossfire wrote:

Wow, from the looks of it you won't even have thermostat housing clearance issues.

Looks great man

This freezing rain has got to go. Good time to patch up the wiring harness I guess. I also disassembled and cleaned the turbo up. I see why exhaust back pressure and a spring can actuate the VGT now.

The weather has been nice the last couple of days. I have the trans and engine mated and the head and intake installed.Good clearance, almost as if it was designed for this engine bay. The ecu is going where the original was installed. There is still tons of work left to do.

Removed about 8 inches of snow off the car today. I picked up an evo 3 cast manifold with external wastegate flange and egt bung installed on it. It's also ceramic coated. I have about ten inches between the motor and wheel well to squeeze the Holset into. I choose the cast manifold because of the weight of the Holset and if I run into any problems I can always just bolt on a 16G.